Talk:2005 University of Oklahoma bombing

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I began this page as a way to collect the information I was seeing in several different locations into one coherent thought. I began Sunday afternoon (central time) and about 3 PM learned that the man who detonated the bomb was someone I knew. I now collect information as a personal tribute of sorts. Please feel free to edit as you will -- Redshield3 05:36, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Condolences. Had to pass the spot on campus today - it was strange, sad. Guettarda 06:03, 3 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Additional details

Additional details - I'll leave it to you to add these to your page, I'll only hose the purty formatting :)

Channel 9 news is reporting that he had a Pakistani roommate, and that he (the bomber) attended the mosque down the block from his house - the same mosque Zacharias Moussoui attended. Yes, that Moussoui. He also tried to buy a large amount of ammonium nitrate the day before.

http://www.newsok.com/video/1633639

Other news sources report that the explosive was TATP, which is made from Hydrogen Peroxide. The bomb it's self wasn't Hydrogen Peroxide.

FBI Joint Terrorism Taskforce is investigating. FBI Statement

Deleting a reference

I am going to delete the following reference: [

Tried To Buy Ammonium Nitrate

POSTED: 5:16 pm CDT October 4, 2005 UPDATED: 6:10 pm CDT October 4, 2005

ARTICLE SNIPPET: "NORMAN, Okla. -- The general manager of a Norman feed store said Tuesday that Joel Henry Hinrichs III had inquired about purchasing a significant amount of ammonium nitrate, the primary ingredient used in the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing.

Dustin Ellison, the general manager of Ellison Feed & Seed on Porter Avenue, said that a man matching Hinrichs' description had come into the store days before he blew himself up on OU's campus. Ellison said the man asked about ammonium nitrate, but couldn't offer a reason why he needed it."

Father Says OU Bomber Wasn't Politically Motivated

More explosives were found in his apartment - was angry, depressed "Swann said suicide attempts are often impulsive, but it is apparent from the cache of explosives authorities found at Hinrichs’ apartment that his actions, whether suicidal or not, were premeditated."

Could we change Hinrichs' picture to a more recent and clear photograph? Here is one courtesy of the Colorado Springs Gazette. Joel Henry HINRICHS III Usedbook 07:41, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Whoever wants to can edit it, I'm not trying to keep people from doing that. I'd actually appreciate the help as school has been particularly rough the last week. - Redshield3 20:23, 5 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

It is interesting to do a comparison between heat-of-the-moment and the composed press release: (below)

Stress is originally overstated on the competency of the teams.
The later version states the site was sealed.
Equipment becomes Dogs.
Awkward wording for the teams was changed.

The officer did have some trouble with pronunciation and coherence of the speech, so it may not be due to revisions after the matter. But I seriously doubt it. This story just doesn't quite add up. --Moonm 13:01, 7 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Text of CNN clip (Original version) Not found

CNN Clip: Explosion occurs near U.S. Stadium Duration: 00:01:36

POLICE OFFICER:

This is a statement by the President in regards to the following situation:

We are apparently dealing with an individual suicide which is under full investigation. At no time was anyone in the stadium in danger. Law enforcement officers and bomb experts on site were activated in the area immediately. As soon as the area was secured, President Boren ordered a thorough search of the garage near the stadium by the trained hazardous device unit teams. Further search of the lower levels outside the stadium and a thorough sweep was also ordered by President Boren in the area where the explosion occurred. Prior to the game, the entire stadium area was swept by the expert hazardous device unit teams with the help of their equipment. Passouts were suspended during the halftime for security reasons in order to enhance safety for the fans. A second device which was found in the area during the initial search has been detonated.

REPORTER: ...Did OU police have any inclination that there was--was there any threat this week leading up to the game?

POLICE OFFICER: There was no indication. Once again our hazard device units, as I stated earlier, are always here during the games to do preliminary checks of the stadium. And there was nothing to indicate--or there was no early intel in regards to the situation...

--That's all we have right now.-- (Cutting off reporters' questions.)

Text of OU's online Statement:Statement by OU President David L. Boren

Statement by OU President David L. Boren who is following the situation:

We are apparently dealing with an individual suicide which is under full investigation. At no time was anyone in the stadium in danger. Law enforcement officers and bomb experts on site were activated in the area immediately. As soon as the area was secured and the area was sealed, President Boren ordered a thorough search of the garage area near the stadium by the trained bomb dog team. Further search of the lower levels outside the stadium and a thorough sweep was ordered by President Boren. Prior to the game, the entire stadium was swept by the expert bomb teams with the help of dogs. Passouts were suspended during the halftime for security reasons in order to enhance safety for the fans. A second device which was found during the initial search has been detonated. President Boren who is convalescing has been in continuous phone contact with law enforcement personnel throughout this period.

There is a great deal of material that can be added though some kind of confirmation work is needed. Unfortunately this might be difficult at present given the surprising lack of interest by the national media. Locally in Norman there is a bit of buzz that the bomber tried to enter the stadium and was denied because he refused to allow his possessions to be searched. [www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1498353/posts Reprinted Tulsa World Article] The local channel 9 is reporting that the bombing had purchased a plane ticket to Algeria and did attend a local mosque, the same one which Zacarias Moussaoui had attended while in Norman.[1] Though those at the Mosque have denied it.[2] And to be fair, there simply is not a lot of choices for a Moslims in Norman thus mere attendence almost certainly not meaningful. Many more links are at Crime Scene Overview of the Suicide Bombing in Norman, Oklahoma, 7:30pm, Saturday, October 1, 2005. Be careful as it links to sites of varing quality. A friend of mine who I will not name, but lives within a block of Andrew's Park, heard the explosion in the bathroom because the window was open. MichaelSH 02:17, 10 October 2005 (UTC) Added note: In case anyone is relying on talk for info: most of the "info" above turned out to be outright wrong. I said it needed confirmation and that confirmation did not come. MichaelSH 05:33, 16 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"off the record"

I strongly suspect that the bombing was the act of a wannabe terrorist, but a few recent edits have been a bit biased in this regard. I don't think it is acceptable to cite claims that someone spoke off the record when there is an on the record denial. I don't think Wikipedia should be reporting rumors (other than the sense of saying that rumors exist). For one thing, we don't don't have any evidence that any knowledgable FBI person actually made this claims "off the record." Indeed look at the cited article makes me extremely skeptical: "Speaking strictly 'off the record,' the officials stated that they recovered 'a significant amount' of Islamic 'Jihad' type literature, some possibly written in Arabic, along with the suspect's computer. Some of the documentation included material on how to construct bomb-making vests." Possibly written in Arabic?!? The FBI can very quickly learn if it is really in Arabic. And if they don't know if it is in Arabic then they clearly cannot read the literature. And in that case how did they know it is Jihadist literature? And that Arabic literature would not be too surprising given that the guy did have a Moslem roommate. All of this should be sending alarm bells that the source might not be credible. I will have to consider either reverting or putting in a dispute tag if this is not fixed in the next few days. MichaelSH 05:29, 11 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks to those who made the edits. It is much better now. I added a brief quote of "possibly written in Arabic" since it is what they alleging source says it will let the reader judge the crediblity of the source. MichaelSH 06:28, 13 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Faculty at gunpoint?

"However this matter escalated past speculation when the police and federal agents in charge of the investigation handcuffed and held at gunpoint an Oklahoma University instructor from Egypt along with various others of foreign descent."

Is there any evidence/a cite for that? Both of my parents are professors at OU and they hadn't heard about that. The predominant sentiment here appears to be that the bombing was not part of a greater "jihadist" plan involving blowing up the stadium. There are much less sinister explainations.

You are quite right. That statement is amost certainly false. And it has not cite to support it. I have edited it out. MichaelSH 01:36, 21 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Deleting a reference

I am going to delete the following reference: [http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=49058 Bomb expert: Simple suicide unlikely at stadium explosion Analysis suggests Oklahoma student meant to explode among 80,000 fans]. 1) It makes claims that are clearly false like repeating the old rumor that Jihadist materials were found in Hinrichs' appartment. Officials have denied that as documented in the article. 2) WorldNetDaily is simply not a credible reference in any event. Ironicaly I actually agree with the article's conclusion that the Hinrich had intended to kill other people. I would be happy if someone can suggest a credible reference supporting the idea that Hinrich was a wannabe terrorist. MichaelSH 02:45, 2 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"Citation needed"

I have removed the two "citation needed" put in by 69.71.166.93. Where (s)he put them in can be seen by looking at this comparison. The first one was that rumors circulated that Jihadist materials had found in Hinrichs' appartment is fairly trivial. Examining the many links the article provides makes that clear including the next footnote. Many examples can be found by simple internet searches. I can also state that as someone who lives within a few miles of where Hinrichs died, that those rumors did circulate. The second "citation needed" was for what Tom Cole said. That surprised me since I originally edited that in and provided a reference. I compared before and after my edit and it is clear that the Dallas Morning News article was the source I used. I did not repeat that reference with each and every sentence and after nearly a year of edits it was not absolutely that it was the source. MichaelSH 21:45, 12 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

"Terrorist"

I should point out that there's a very odd definition of "terrorist" in this article. When some right-leaning bloggers accused him of being Muslim, he was under suspicion of being a "terrorist." When the Islam tie was more or less disproven, he was "not a terrorist." Excuse me, but I think suicide bombing could be considered terrorism, regardless of the religion of the perpretrator. 69.113.86.25 (talk) 06:55, 8 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Why is Timothy McVeigh's suicide considered an act of terrorism whilst this is not? (89.242.150.214 (talk) 12:25, 21 January 2010 (UTC))[reply]

Because McVeigh's suicide also resulted in the deaths of 168 others while Hinrichs only resulted in his own. There is no evidence he targeted others.—NMajdan•talk 13:21, 21 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]