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@JeanetteMartin, I'm confident you are mistaken on this. It makes sense to say "Xayalith is a New Zealander" but not "Xayalith is a New Zealander musician". Here's why: New Zealander refers to the person, i.e., it's a demonym. New Zealand is an adjective that refers to all things from NZ, including people (musicians). This is different from Mexican, which is both a demonym and an adjective. Different rules apply to different country names. If you don't believe me, look it up on Google, ask a chatbot, or request a third opinion, but definitely stop reverting until there is a consensus on the issue. Revirvlkodlaku (talk) 03:02, 22 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Read any biographical article. They say American, Mexican, Australian, German, French....not "United States, Mexico, Australia, Germany France"..in fact, the same goes for businesses' articles too. So, New Zealander is the appropriate term. Oh and also, this:Lists of New Zealanders. Jeanette The Puerto Rican Molly Ringwald Martipn (loser's talk page 07:14, 22 October, 2024 (UTC)
@JeanetteMartin, somehow, I'm not getting through to you. Many demonyms, such as the ones you listed, work as adjectives as well, which is why you can say "an American" and "an American musician". Unfortunately, New Zealand is not one of those. "Xayalith is a New Zealander" refers strictly to Xayalith. "New Zealand musician" refers to a thing from New Zealand—a musician.
Actually, you've demonstrated it yourself with the link you posted, which you seem to think supports your position: Lists of New Zealanders. Every single category (List of New Zealand university leaders, List of New Zealand actors, List of New Zealand architects) is "list of New Zealand...", not "list of New Zealander..." Heck, even List of New Zealand musicians!!! It doesn't say "List of New Zealander musicians", does it? Now click through a bunch of those musicians listed; how many of them says "New Zealander musician"?!
Revirvlkodlaku is right on this. When we say someone is a New Zealand musician we are using New Zealand as an adjective for the country not a demonym for the people. Alisa Xayalith is a New Zealander, but they are are New Zealand musician. The same way Pedro Sánchez is a Spaniard but is the Spanish Prime Minister and a Spanish politician. See [1] and [2]+[3]. Or [4][5][6][7][8]Nil Einne (talk) 05:55, 23 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Nil Einne @Revirvlkodlaku "New Zealand musician" is perfectly acceptable and reflects common usage. You will see this construction used a lot in coverage of Taika Waititi and Jacinda Ardern, two well-known New Zealanders who receive a lot of international coverage. Here, New Zealand is being used as an attributive noun. Attributive nouns are "nouns that act like adjectives"[10][11] but they don't have all the properties of true adjectives. This is why "New Zealand" and "Spanish" both work before "musician" but aren't equally suited in other constructions.
The use of place names attributively happens to be a weird interest of mine. I have searched for a formal rule or usage guide and have not found comprehensive guidance but I have noticed some patterns. Countries with compound names that include a regular word (like "new") in the name can often be used attributively. This also works for their initialisms. See: a New Zealand politician, the United States president, UK parliament. This does not work for one-name countries; you would not say the America president or an England prince or the France singer. You must use and adjectival form or possessive for these one-word country names. Attributive usage is also common for subnational place names—cities, states, etc.—as in a Paris café, two Washington apples, the New York mayor. Sometimes there are subtle differences in the attributive vs. adjectival form. A Parisian café might be located anywhere in the world and this would describe the menu and perhaps aesthetic, much like an Irish pub or Vietnamese restaurant.
Usage in newspaper headlines and in sports references can be more permissive.
I don't know that there is a strict "rule" here. Usage may vary. Appealing to common usage across different sources makes sense. Otherwise it comes down to what "sounds right" which can be unsatisfying and may not be universal. I prefer "New Zealand musician" over "New Zealander." The list of adjectival forms and demonyms does not settle this. The existence of a distinctive adjectival form does not in and of itself make the attributive noun usage incorrect. --MYCETEAE 🍄🟫—talk17:55, 25 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
You and I are in agreement but I did feel the best approach was to ping both involved editors. My lengthy treatise was perhaps a bit self-indulgent. Hopefully an additional perspective from someone not otherwise involved in the question at hand is helpful 😃 --MYCETEAE 🍄🟫—talk18:06, 26 October 2024 (UTC)[reply]
