Talk:Flying junction

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Flying junction article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

Trains High‑importance

	Trains Portal
DYK	November 11, 2008

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Trains, an attempt to build a comprehensive and detailed guide to rail transport on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, you can visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion. See also: WikiProject Trains to do list and the Trains Portal.TrainsWikipedia:WikiProject TrainsTemplate:WikiProject Trainsrail transport articles

High

This article has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale.

This article lacks references.

Tip: Anchors are case-sensitive in most browsers.

This article links to one or more target anchors that no longer exist.

[[TGV#Tracks|TGV]] The anchor (#Tracks) is no longer available because it was deleted by a user before.

Please help fix the broken anchors. You can remove this template after fixing the problems. | Reporting errors

Livesites doesn't work on Macs. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.199.156.119 (talk) 01:37, 9 January 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Possible improvements

As a reader, I don't understand the term 'LGV' used in the high speed rail section. Perhaps this could be clarified, or a link provided to another article where the term is defined? Benthatsme (talk) 23:18, 8 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've made a link to LGV (Lignes à Grande Vitesse) (ie French high-speed rail lines) as requested. Sorry it took so long; I only just noticed it. Tim PF (talk) 20:53, 24 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Inaccuracy concerning French high-speed junctions

The statement that the diverging speed on French LGV junctions is 160 mph is incorrect. The principal junction on the TGV Sud-Est at Pasilly where the line to Dijon diverges from the line to Lyon, and the junction on the LGV Atlantique at Courtalain where the line to Le Mans diverges from the line to Tours, are both equipped with special high-speed switches (points in British terminology) which permit a diverging speed of 220 km/h (140 mph).

The article should be corrected. I'm not making the correction because I don't know the computer procedure for entering the 220 km/h to 140 m;ph conversion.

Incidentally, ordinary crossovers on French LGV's do in fact allow a diverging speed of 160 km/h. Prospero10 (talk) 04:47, 29 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I've added the conversion template to that bit, so that "{{convert|220|km/h|mph|0|abbr=on}}" gives "220 km/h (137 mph)"). You should now be able to make the addition yourself.
Like you, I'm not doing it myself, as it needs a reference or two for both 160 and 220 km/h diverging speeds, and I'm not going to make any uncited additions.
When you add the reference(s), you'll need to remove the HTML comments around the new dummy "References" section (and you may also change the {{unreferenced}} to {{refimprove}}).
If you don't know the magic for citing a reference, reply here with a bare URL, and I'll wave a chicken over the article, if someone doesn't do it first. Tim PF (talk) 21:16, 29 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, TIM. The references needed are to high-speed railway switches named (as I recall) Appareil de Voie tg005 and Appareil de Voie tg007. Concerning their installation on the LGV Sud-Est and LGV-Atlantique, I would have to find a reference in my stacks of French publications such as La Vie du Rail, and I don't know when I'll find the reference. I looked for references, and I did find a mention in the catalog of the maker of the equipnment, Vossloh-Cogifer, which corrects my statement: the diverging speed is actually 230 km/h, for the faster switch. I could reference the supplier's catalog, which says that they make such a switch, but it does not say where it's installed. To avoid making uncited additions, as of now I am not making an editing change in the article. However, that leaves the 'Flying Junction' article with an unreferenced statement about 160 km/h, an incorrect statement.

On a second subject: someone asks for a picture of a flying junction. Such a picture can be found in both French and German Wikipedias, under 'Fichier:LGV Interconnexion Est: Raccordement de Messy' in fr.wikipedia. The junction in that picture is really too elaborate, with the flyover itself in the rear of the picture, but it's certainly better than no picture. It may be worth including. The photo is already in Wikipedia Commons. Prospero10 (talk) 23:24, 30 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

If you think that part of the current wording is incorrect, then it should either be amended (eg "and a normal limit of 160 km/h (99 mph) for the diverging path"), or tagged with something like {{dubious}} (follow that link and you might find a better tag). Tim PF (talk) 11:55, 1 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

In the case of Fretin, I think that Paris↔Brussels (main path) is 300 km/h. Paris↔Lille (diverging) is ~200/220 km/h and Brussels↔Lille (diverging at both ends) is 160 km/h. This is from published Video 125 cab videos and my (own) GPS data, but I don't have a source unless it's spoken on the video commentary. —Sladen (talk) 00:16, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I HAVE A REFERENCE. The article in French Wikipedia on 'Courtalain' describes the junction on the LGV-Atlantique, and says that the diverging speed is 220 km/h (I visited this site when the LGV-Atlantique was under construction). SO I WILL NOW EDIT THIS IN.

The interesting contribution by —Sladen above sounds very plausible, very likely it's accurate. The heavily-used diverging route to Lille, which is used by Paris-London Eurostar trains, uses switches with 220 km/h diverging speed to least delay trains between Paris and London. Prospero10 (talk) 21:51, 2 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]