Talk:Ruadhri of Bute

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Descent claims

"who claimed descent through his hereditary to the Isle of Bute". No idea what is intended here. Ben Mac Dui 17:56, 4 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Names

About the name 'MacRuadri'. I think the only source he appears in is the saga, and it doesn't give him a patronym or surname. From what I've read, historians have suggested that he may have been a son of Uspak, a man possibly of Hebridean heritage who was made king by Hakon, and who perished after assaulting the island the generation before. I'm not sure how Ruadhri's article should be titled, but I don't think we should give him the MacRuadri surname. Something like Ruadhri (Bute)?

Maybe Ruadhri de Bute would be more appealing, seeing as his ancestry is unknown? I thought I had seen a reference to (MacRory) in my reading travels, but could be wrong. Newm30 (talk) 02:48, 11 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

How about just "of Bute", "de Bute" makes it seem like an attested name from some medieval source.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 05:54, 12 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Another thing, has anyone seen any discussion on the identity of the man who left his name upon the castle? I've wondered if it could not have been this character. But look what this source has to say: [1]. The 'Roderick son of Reginald' must be Ruaidhri mac Raghnaill; but was this figure ever granted Bute? What evidence is there for that claim, and who granted it to him? From what I've read, the reasoning is that the Stewarts appear to have gained the island in about 1200. McDonald's Kingdom of the Isles mentions Bute and the 1263 Ruadhri on page 111.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 10:03, 5 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

In this source [2], it was named after Ethachius Rothay, great-grandson of Simon Brec. Newm30 (talk) 02:52, 11 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Cool. The author of that book actually thinks it's from a Norse term for lawmen. This pdf is by Steve Boardman [3]. At the bottom of page 99 and into 100 Boardman goes on about Eochaid Rothay ('Ethachius Rothay'). The Broun book cited by Boardman is previewable on GoogleBooks. On pages 69-73 of Broun's book, he goes on about how Eochaid Rothay was likely created in the 12th century through a misreading of a name on a royal genealogy - Echdach Buadaig (Eochaid Buadach) into Echdaig Rothai. Afterwards someone associated this new figure with the island on account of the similarity of the words. Conveniently in the 13th century, this figure was used to give the Scots an 'historical right' to reclaiming the contested islands.

Also, see Boardman on page 95, where goes on about Bute and the Stewarts in 1200, and also notes in the footnote the record of a few men styled "of Bute" in the early 13th century. I wonder if these two were relations of Ruadhri, or if they were just mere residents on Bute or only associated with the island.--Brianann MacAmhlaidh (talk) 05:54, 12 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]