Template talk:Indianapolis Colts roster

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Indianapolis Colts (inactive)

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Ben Utecht RFA or UFA?

First off, the standard on Wikipedia is verifiability. Just because someone thinks they know something to be correct doesn't qualify it for Wikipedia.

Doing a quick search, the vast majority of sources show Utecht as a RFA.

[1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]

However, addressing Pats1's comments in the revision log, here's where I believe the confusion lies:

"Accrued Seasons – An Accrued Season is a season during which a player has been on full pay status (Active, Inactive or Injured Reserve List) for six (6) or more regular season games. However, a player who is on the Exempt Commissioner Permission List, the Reserve Physically Unable to Perform/Non Football Injury List, or the Practice Squad for any of the six (6) qualifying games will not earn an Accrued Season regardless of his pay status."[7]

"2004: Spent entire season on Physically Unable to Perform List."[8]

According to NFLPA's website, Utecht's 2004 season on the PUP would not an accrued season. Utecht accrued seasons in 2005, 2006 & 2007, giving him 3. (Utecht's 2004 season does count as a "credited season" for benefit purposes, but not for free agency.)

"A player with three (3) but less than four (4) Accrued Seasons when his contract expires becomes a Restricted Free Agent."[9]

Bjewiki (Talk) 15:11, 22 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

First off, Utecht did not earn an accredited season in 2004. An accredited season is 3 games on the 53-man roster, and nothing else -- no IR, no PUP, no NFI, etc. To quote the CBA:

Section 7. Credited Season: For purposes of calculating Credited Seasons under this Article only, a player shall earn one Credited Season for each season during which he was on, or should have been on, full pay
status for a total of three or more regular season games, but which, irrespective of the player’s pay status, shall not include games for which this player was on: (i) the Exempt Commissioner Permission List; (ii) the Reserve PUP List as a result of a non-football injury; (iii) a Club’s Practice or Developmental Squad;
or (iv) a Club’s Injured Reserve List.

And in that sense, this is dead wrong.

Again, to quote the CBA:

Section 1. Accrued Seasons Calculation:
(a) For the purposes of calculating Accrued Seasons under this Agreement, a player shall receive one Accrued Season for each season during which he was on, or should have been on, full pay status for a total of six or more regular season games, but which, irrespective of the player’s pay status, shall not include games for which the player was on: (i) the Exempt Commissioner Permission List, (ii) the Reserve PUP List as a result of
a nonfootball injury, or (iii) a Club’s Practice or Development Squad.

By "Reserve PUP as the result of a nonfootball injury," I'm almost dead certain that means only the NFI list, and NOT the PUP list.

The other issue at hand here is actual process of the PUP. There's a gray area out there when players on PUP have their practice period end. At that time, most writers will say the player can either be "placed on the 53-man roster, released, traded, or placed on IR." I'm not sure if that's entirely correct. By "placed on IR," it may mean that they just stay on PUP for the rest of the season as if they were on IR. Others take it to mean that the PUP list itself expires and a player is then transferred to IR. I'll try to get a definitive answer on that.

Thirdly, I'm again almost certain that Utecht was a RFA last offseason. Since he a accrued a season in 2007, that would automatically make him a UFA this offseason.

HOWEVER I can give you a definitive answer here. According to the NFLPA active player search, Utecht made $435,000 in 2007. That's an ERFA tender (the lowest RFA tender was $850k), specifically for a 2-accredited season player. That part doesn't matter, because a player can technically have 100 accredited seasons and still be an ERFA. But the fact of the matter is, Utecht was an ERFA last season, which makes him an RFA this season. I stand corrected.

Also, in terms of verifiability, sometimes you have to ignore all rules for the sake of being correct. We all know that even the most verifiable institutions do get this stuff wrong. Pats1 ^T/C 17:58, 22 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well whether or not all the UFAs, RFAs and ERFAs are correct (and I've noticed mistakes too) I think it's safe to say that as free agency approaches you'll see lists for each team. We'll get them down by then I'd say.►Chris Nelson^Holla! 18:05, 22 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Such as? I'd like to investigate them. Pats1 ^T/C 18:56, 22 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Also, I've been looking into the PUP/IR issue too. I keep finding things both ways. Some say (including team releases...but we know the verifiability of those...) that PUPers whose practice period expires go to IR, some (like ProFW) say they remain on PUP for the rest of the season. It's obviously a big distinction. If PUP doesn't count in the accrued season calculation, but IR does, then players who stay on PUP won't gain an accrued season. Yet players who go from PUP to IR once their practice period expires (Week 11), will be on the IR for the last 7 games of the season and thus do gain an accrued season. I need to find an official explanation. Pats1 ^T/C 19:02, 22 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Maybe there's a difference between being practicing during your 3-week practice period and then possibly going on IR, and not practicing during your 3-week window and staying on PUP for the rest of the year. I just don't know. Pats1 ^T/C 19:33, 22 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Quinn Pitcock

Does anyone know why Quinn Pitcock is still on the "current" Colts roster? He retired from the NFL almost a year ago. Manningmbd (talk) 19:14, 8 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Because he still hasn't officially retired (i.e. be placed on Reserve/Retired). He's still under contract with team and on the Reserve/Did Not Report list. Players have been known to stick on that list for more than a year - see J. J. Milan before they come back, are released, or placed on Reserve/Retired. Pats1 ^T/C 19:33, 8 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Marvin Harrison

Do not remove Marvin Harrison from the list and do not change his article until something is confirmed. Yes, more than likely he will be released, but nothing has happened yet. Once it is actually confirmed and a press release has been made, then you may change it. But at this point, absolutely nobody has made the notion that he has been released. Adam Shefter says his days in Indianapolis are numbered, but he's not gone yet.

Thanks. Manningmbd (talk) 18:12, 19 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

PUP List

Hello all, I earlier edited this template and added Marlin Jackson and Bob Sanders to the PUP list. Link ESPN reported it, and considering that the Colts rarely update rosters, depth charts, and injury reports unless they absolutely have to, I figured it was OK to add them to the list here. Evidently not. What is the protocol for this kind of stuff? I'm not trying to be a nuisance, just trying to learn. Thanks. Manningmbd (talk) 18:06, 24 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

That just means that they'll probably put them on Active/PUP come the start of camp. Pats1 ^T/C 21:25, 24 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Bob Sanders

When did Bob Sanders get injured he was fine? When did we add the new tight end? Southwood Paul (talk) 00:14, 7 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

http://blogs.indystar.com/philb/2009/11/bobzilla_to_ir.html ... http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4628597 Pats1 ^T/C 00:24, 7 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Drew Willy

Active Willy was promoted to the active squad on December 26; does this require a change to the template (e.g. a jersey number)? —Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 23:11, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Done Eagles 24/7 (C) 23:16, 27 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Jacques McClendon

Why is Jacques McClendon listed as number 80 and listed as a Tight End when the Colts official website lists him as a guard wearing number 65?

http://www.colts.com/sub.cfm?page=roster —Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.230.57.85 (talk) 22:38, 17 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The Colts never updated their site. He switched to #80 to play TE because of all the injuries they have. RevanFan (talk) 00:10, 18 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

OLB/DE

It is absolutely original research at this point to say that players like Freeney, Mathis, Hughes, etc will be used as OLB's under a system that has yet to be developed. There are STILL defensive ends in a 3-4 system. So long as the Colts own website lists them as DE's, there's no reason to list them differently here. There are NO sources saying that any of them are OLB's. 20:03, 10 March 2012 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.252.23.219 (talk)

NFL.com and ESPN.com also have them listed as DE's still, as do many other sites. I fail to see why wikipedia seems to think we know better than other official sources that are commonly use to cite articles about athletes. 76.252.23.219 (talk) 20:12, 10 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]