User talk:OMINOREG

Welcome

Hello OMINOREG and welcome to Wikipedia! I am Ukexpat and I would like to thank you for your contributions.

Getting Started First steps • FAQ • Article creation wizard Wikipedia Tutorial • The five pillars of Wikipedia How to: edit a page • upload an image Getting help Community Portal • Help desk • Village Pump Where to ask questions or make comments • Request administrator attention Wikipedia: The Missing Manual Place {{helpme}} on your talk page and a small message explaining the problem Thanks for advice. OMINOREG (talk) 10:51, 2 October 2010 (UTC)[reply] The Commmunity Build consensus • Resolving disputes Assume good faith • Civility • Etiquette No personal attacks • No legal threats Signpost • IRC channels • Mailing lists		Policies and Guidelines Neutral point of view • Reliable sources Verifiability • Citing sources • No original research What Wikipedia is not • Biographies of living persons Manual of Style • Three-revert rule • Sock puppetry Copyrights • Fair use • Image use policy External links • Spam • Vandalism Deletion policy • Conflict of interest • Notability Things to do Be bold in editing • Help develop an article Pages needing attention • Peer review Join a WikiProject • Translating articles Cleaning up: General • Spam • Vandalism User pages • Talk pages Useful templates • Tools • User scripts

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ukexpat (talk) 15:29, 27 September 2010 (UTC) Many thanks Ukexpat. You may be amazed to find that a contributor claiming to be an Administrator has attempted to block me permanently for one of the items you congratulated me on! How does one cope with that?[reply]

English Channel.

Apologies, I think I inadvertently removed some work on the English Channel relating to P.S.DEFIANCE. I was attempting to remove vandalism and I think there may have been an edit clash.

On another note, it may be useful if you write a few lines about yourself on your user page. Although it's not essential, it improves your credibility and helps distinguish writers from vandals.
Regards JRPG (talk) 17:03, 28 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, can you be careful when adding data into tables. The formatting can be quite tricky if you're not used to it and some of youre edits are dsirupting the tables. Also if you are going to change the name of a reference please change all the references that use that name. You changed one from Mariner Mirror to Mariner's Mirror without finding the other occurance and it orphaned one of your reference points. I know I didn't use quite the correct title in using Mariner Mirror but it's only a reference name nothing that appears in the text. Thanks. NtheP (talk) 22:38, 30 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Problems

This help request has been answered. If you need more help, you can ask another question on your talk page, contact the responding user(s) directly on their user talk page, or consider visiting the Teahouse.

Thanks for your kind message. What a relief to have some pleasant words directed to me in my present situation, having been unjustly accused of vandalism, without the opportunity of defending myself. The DEFIANCE item was just a small example of my main interest, which is in the early steamships.

I must admit that I'm confused. Where have you been accused of vandalism? You also mentioned elsewhere that you were blocked by a "claimed administrator" - when was this? Where was it (there is no such mention anywhere in the history of this page). Without more information, I can neither investigate further nor help -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 08:46, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I've just realised that you might be talking about your edits to Submarine snorkel which were reverted with the summary not well expressed, but main problem is that it is not sourced (see WP:NOR - which is not a claim of vandalism. -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 08:49, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Somebody, presumably the Swede Rig Welter, (who was even claiming to be my Administrator), persists in trying to block me, and is still using the following words in his attacks: vandal account, infinite blocking and destroying. I gave the substantiated source for my statement on the submarine snorkel, which was the target of his attack; this was the number of the British Patent (No.106330) granted to the renowned Scotts Shipbuilding & Engineering co. Ltd., Greenock, Scotland and James Richardson, an assistant manager with them. I wrote the above here, because I do not know how to deal with the "helped"/help me" instruction.

I might be a bit thick here, but where are these attempts to block you, where are those attacks? The user you are presumably referring to is User:Riggwelter, who is indeed Swedish according to their user page but your account wasn't created until 24th September 2010, and his account was last used on 19 September for 1 edit, with the previous edit being in June - and he has never edited any of the articles which you have edited. If you continue with these persistent personal attack on this user, I will block you from editing Wikipedia.

If you have anything to substantiate your claims above, please provide proof (in the form of 'diffs' - see here for how to get those). Further personal attacks on any editor will result in a block, but if there is substance in your claims (it might be that you have accidently named the wrong editor), then you must provide them so that I can look into this further. -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 13:55, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Please ignore the above (apart from the bit about personal attacks) - I've worked out what you are on about. Riggwelter is an admin on the Swedish Wikipedia, and blocked you there for vandalism - not helped by the fact that you chose to write in English rather than Swedish. However, no one on the English Wikipedia can help you over there - each Wikipedia is independent. To appeal a block on the Swedish Wikipedia, you need to follow the instructions at sv:Wikipedia:Blockeringar och avstängningar, specifically sv:Wikipedia:Blockeringar_och_avstängningar#.C3.96verklagande ("Appeals"). If you had explained that your problems had been on the Swedish Wikipedia, you would have received this advice much more quickly -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 14:03, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Correction You didn't just write in English on the talk page, you rewrote the Swedish entry in English! If someone did that on this Wikipedia, they'd likely be blocked as well, especially after having a message left on their talk page explaining that the Wikipedia's language should be used (Riggwelter wrote Hi! This is Wikipedia in swedish. All contributions must therefor be in swedish on your talk page at the Swedish Wikipedia) -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 14:07, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I have not asked to be bound in some way to Swedish Wikipedia. Is this because I happen to live in Sweden? Even my very identity OMINOREG has been questioned too. There is something wrong somewhere and it is time something was done about it. I have just keyed in "snorkel" and received this answer in English, note not in Swedish: "You tried to edit a page on Wikipedia, but currently you can not edit pages. Your user name or your IP address has been blocked by your administrator Rig Welter the ground: vandal account. Blocking duration: infinite." A further attempt with another item brought forward this: "This account is blocked indefinitely. Because of User contributions asssumed to this account have created for the sole purpose of destroying on Wikipedia. See also block log". I now have the task, at present seemingly impossible, of getting my case heard on Swedish Wikipedia, because everywhere I turn, it seems I have been cornered into a Catch 22 situation. Suggestions as to how I might be able do this are gladly welcome; perhaps somebody else has had such an experience. Hjälp!

You are not blocked on this Wikipedia - only the Swedish one, for the reasons I gave above. The block notice you received would only be seen on the Swedish Wikipedia. However, I am going to block you for 24 hours for your disruptive behaviour on this Wikipedia - namely your "appeal" placed in the Piltdown Man article in this edit and this edit.

If (when your block expires) you continue to be disruptive on this Wikipedia, then you will be blocked again. Your issue with regard to being blocked is on the Swedish Wikipedia - the English Wikipedia has no authority there, and you need to request an unblock using the link I provided yesterday. -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 09:19, 30 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Incidentally, looking at your SUL record, I see that you initially created your account at the Swedish Wikipedia (your account on this Wikipedia was automatically created when you visited this site a bit under 2 hours later). As the Wikipedia where the account was created, the Swedish one is your default one when you go to Wikipedia, I'm guessing. -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 09:24, 30 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Editing your talk page

For future reference, if you want to remove anything from your talk page, you can do so - the only exceptions are listed at WP:REMOVED. -- PhantomSteve/talk|contribs\ 10:38, 1 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Steamboat

Please don't write opinions on why you removed text on the article page as you did on Steamship. If you feel it needs explaining then please do so on the article talk page. If as the edit summary suggests what you wrote is a quote from a history then it needs to be explained as such. The way you inserted it makes it look like you opinion you are adding. Incidentally you don't sign using ~~~~ edits in articles. NtheP (talk) 11:12, 1 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

October 2010

Please do not add or change content without citing verifiable and reliable sources, as you did to Submarine snorkel. Before making any potentially controversial edits, it is recommended that you discuss them first on the article's talk page. Please review the guidelines at Wikipedia:Citing sources and take this opportunity to add references to the article. Thank you. Please understand this - you need to provide a source. Also, you need to write from a neutral point of view. Philip Trueman (talk) 09:00, 2 October 2010 (UTC) I am nonplussed at being told that I gave no source for my text on Scotts' submarine snorkel. I quoted the British Patent No 106330; what better source?OMINOREG (talk) 09:14, 2 October 2010 (UTC) I would be glad of help to be shown how I should have presented the material to suit Wikipedia's style.OMINOREG (talk) 09:41, 2 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

There are two things here. Firstly the reference, you need to provide a reference for where you got the information about the patent from. This can be either an online or printed source but needs to be given, preferably as a <ref> </ref> i.e. not appearing in the body of the text but in the references section.

Secondly is the neutral writing style. In the current revision of Submarine snorkel you have written Sadly, because the British Admiralty showed no interest, the submarine snorkel designed by James Richardson, an Assistant Manager at Scotts Engineering Co. Ltd, Greenock, Scotland as early as 1917, was never developed. Reference: British Patent No. 106330 of 21 May 1917. The offending word is Sadly - this is what makes it non neutral. Sadly for who? Frankly only the Royal Navy. I'm sure the German Navy were quite happy that the British did not have the same functionality as them. You need to remember that you are writing for a global audience not just a British one. Incidentally you also need to quote a source for the information that the Admiralty showed no interest otherwise it's just your opinion.

The final thing is to decide where in the article the information needs to appear. In this case I'm not sure it's the lead paragraph but perhaps better in the history section. This isn't the only occasion the placement of information has been queried - see the last edit summary on William Murdoch, the information you added about the Earl of Dundonald having gas in his house in 1789 is interesting but please ask yourself is the lead section of an article about someone else the best place to put it? At the top of your talk page, someone placed a welcome message with a lot of useful links, please read some of them and you'll find many of your questions answered. Otherwise continue to ask on here or at the various help desks. NtheP (talk) 10:30, 2 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

References

See it's easy to quote your sources :-) The changes you made to the article of steamships, I've made one small alteration to and that is to make them inline references rather than appear in the body of the text. This places them on the same format as other references in this article. You can see how this was done by clicking here (although I've just seen that I made a spelling mistake!) . The only other change was to revert some wording to The following year from your In 1789, this is only for stylistic reasons as other wise too many consectutive sentences start with In <year>. NtheP (talk) 13:17, 2 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The late Johnston Fraser Robb, a Manager at Scotts, gained in 1993 a Ph.D. for his "Scotts of Greenock, A Family Enterprise, 1820-1920". The text is available from the British Library on CD Ethos 513119. Their snorkel is dealt with on page 424, complete with drawings. Can this be used as a reference?

Does it support what you wrote i.e. that British patent 106330 was awarded to Scott? If so then yes it's a valid reference. Let me ask the question another way round. How do you know this particular patent was granted to Scott on the date stated? NtheP (talk) 11:24, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I checked on the patent itself! I still don't know how to show Ref, instead of Source in the text, as I have done and you commented on.

All you have to do is put <ref> </ref> round your text. Can you put the espacenet link on here and then I will insert it into the article because I must admit I can't find it on there. NtheP (talk) 15:19, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I went into espacenet advanced search and put in GB106330 in patent publication number.OMINOREG (talk) 15:40, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Doesn't work for me. It returns 0 results. Can you run the search and put the url on here? NtheP (talk) 16:31, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Hope it works for you now: http://ep.espacenet.com/advancedSearch OMINOREG (talk) 18:15, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Great, just what was needed. Now to insert as a ref it goes in as the completed search not the blank one. You alos don't need to add bitsa like The patent can be found at . . that is implicit in the reference. That's why I put it immedaitely after the part of the sentence about the patent not at the end. NtheP (talk) 19:56, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your help!OMINOREG (talk) 20:01, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

My pleasure. I can see you've had a bit of a rough start which given your obvious knowledge is a shame and I just wanted to help you avoid hitting any more snags. If I can help in the future just leave a message on my talk page. NtheP (talk) 20:30, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks again!OMINOREG (talk) 20:36, 3 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]

PS v SS

There's a discussion going on at Talk:SS Great Western you might be interested in/able to help with. It's about the correct designation for the Great Western. Should it be PS or SS? NtheP (talk) 16:45, 15 October 2010 (UTC)[reply]